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	<title>Comments on: Abandon all hope for a profitable Civic Center</title>
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	<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/</link>
	<description>Media and news from the original river city</description>
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		<title>By: Anti -Dumass</title>
		<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/comment-page-1/#comment-92091</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti -Dumass</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2007 17:00:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/#comment-92091</guid>
		<description>When I moved to Peoria to go to Bradley, everyone in my hometown had an image of Peoria as a crime capital/cesspool and had pretty much written me off as a future chalk outline.  I ignored their pleas to go to the safety of pretty much anywhere else, and moved down here.  And the more I explored this city, the more I loved it down here.  

I love O&#039;Brien Field, the Civic Center, and all the Riverfront Development among other things.  You know why?!?  Because when people from my hometown actually come down here to attend an event or go see a ballgame, they actually realize that Peoria isn&#039;t some dank, evil place.  They actually see a thriving city that is an outpost here in South Central Illinois.  A place to actually stop in and have a good time, rather than to desperately bypass on the way to somewhere else.  

And wouldn&#039;t you know, the more we look all spiffy and shiny to more and more people, the more money might get spent here.  And the more amenities and happy people we have here, the more businesses we might attract to get more jobs.  And more jobs just make everybody happy!  And then  . . . maybe . . .if we&#039;re lucky . . . we will be lucy enough to be graced with the presence of Fleetwood Mac!!!!!   

So unless you personally are paying the $300,000 all by yourself, just sit back, and relax for a little bit.  The city is getting better.  Would you rather live in Peoria 1987 or 2007?  This city was written off as being unsavable at one point, but I do believe this city is looking pretty damn good right now.  And it&#039;s only gonna get better.  

And if you really want to see certain acts perform at the Civic Center, they love feedback.  Seriously email them a list and they WILL take it under advisement.  If your propsed event sells out, then congrats!  You did it!  Here comes the black ink . . . you&#039;re a hero!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When I moved to Peoria to go to Bradley, everyone in my hometown had an image of Peoria as a crime capital/cesspool and had pretty much written me off as a future chalk outline.  I ignored their pleas to go to the safety of pretty much anywhere else, and moved down here.  And the more I explored this city, the more I loved it down here.  </p>
<p>I love O&#8217;Brien Field, the Civic Center, and all the Riverfront Development among other things.  You know why?!?  Because when people from my hometown actually come down here to attend an event or go see a ballgame, they actually realize that Peoria isn&#8217;t some dank, evil place.  They actually see a thriving city that is an outpost here in South Central Illinois.  A place to actually stop in and have a good time, rather than to desperately bypass on the way to somewhere else.  </p>
<p>And wouldn&#8217;t you know, the more we look all spiffy and shiny to more and more people, the more money might get spent here.  And the more amenities and happy people we have here, the more businesses we might attract to get more jobs.  And more jobs just make everybody happy!  And then  . . . maybe . . .if we&#8217;re lucky . . . we will be lucy enough to be graced with the presence of Fleetwood Mac!!!!!   </p>
<p>So unless you personally are paying the $300,000 all by yourself, just sit back, and relax for a little bit.  The city is getting better.  Would you rather live in Peoria 1987 or 2007?  This city was written off as being unsavable at one point, but I do believe this city is looking pretty damn good right now.  And it&#8217;s only gonna get better.  </p>
<p>And if you really want to see certain acts perform at the Civic Center, they love feedback.  Seriously email them a list and they WILL take it under advisement.  If your propsed event sells out, then congrats!  You did it!  Here comes the black ink . . . you&#8217;re a hero!</p>
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		<title>By: Raoul Duke</title>
		<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/comment-page-1/#comment-92080</link>
		<dc:creator>Raoul Duke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2007 14:22:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/#comment-92080</guid>
		<description>Performance based pay in government would in theory solve almost all of the problems in most municipalities, it will however never happen. Gubmnt is gubmnt and bidnis is bidnis the two are such polar opposites in the way they function it is virtually impossible for government employees to fathom how running a for profit entity works, as it is frustrating and impossible for people involved in running a business to fathom how a government can run at all. The biggest problem in with employees in most city/park situations is getting rid of them when they do not perform at all, you just can&#039;t. It sucks and needs to be changed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Performance based pay in government would in theory solve almost all of the problems in most municipalities, it will however never happen. Gubmnt is gubmnt and bidnis is bidnis the two are such polar opposites in the way they function it is virtually impossible for government employees to fathom how running a for profit entity works, as it is frustrating and impossible for people involved in running a business to fathom how a government can run at all. The biggest problem in with employees in most city/park situations is getting rid of them when they do not perform at all, you just can&#8217;t. It sucks and needs to be changed.</p>
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		<title>By: BeanCounter</title>
		<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/comment-page-1/#comment-92077</link>
		<dc:creator>BeanCounter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2007 14:05:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/#comment-92077</guid>
		<description>Lack of a Civic Center wouldn&#039;t turn Peoria into an East St. Louis.  Declining stable industry head of household jobs and rising crime will....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lack of a Civic Center wouldn&#8217;t turn Peoria into an East St. Louis.  Declining stable industry head of household jobs and rising crime will&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: chefkevin</title>
		<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/comment-page-1/#comment-92076</link>
		<dc:creator>chefkevin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2007 13:54:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/#comment-92076</guid>
		<description>So, Mouse you are saying that there is not one civic center, zoo, park district, etc. in the country that operates in the black?  Can&#039;t prove that, but I highly doubt it.

I look at the concerts (performers and frequency) at the Mark in Moline and it just blows Peoria away.  I&#039;ve probably been to as many concerts at the Mark than Peoria...Fleetwood Mac, Eric Clapton, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Counting Crows, Matchbox 20 are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head that PACKED the Mark.  These and other bands can&#039;t be drawn to Peoria (when they are in their prime)?

I&#039;m not going to spend countless hours doing research to prove the Civic Center was to make money.  But you are probably right:  only in Peoria would they build things to lose money.

A-Dumass - Where did I say to close it?  I&#039;m not saying close it, I&#039;m asking for fiscal responsibility to the community. My salary is bonus based on performance...maybe THAT pay structure should be initiated at some of Peoria&#039;s money losing tax supported identities.  You can&#039;t live off the base, but the closer you get the budget to black, the better your paycheck becomes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So, Mouse you are saying that there is not one civic center, zoo, park district, etc. in the country that operates in the black?  Can&#8217;t prove that, but I highly doubt it.</p>
<p>I look at the concerts (performers and frequency) at the Mark in Moline and it just blows Peoria away.  I&#8217;ve probably been to as many concerts at the Mark than Peoria&#8230;Fleetwood Mac, Eric Clapton, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Counting Crows, Matchbox 20 are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head that PACKED the Mark.  These and other bands can&#8217;t be drawn to Peoria (when they are in their prime)?</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not going to spend countless hours doing research to prove the Civic Center was to make money.  But you are probably right:  only in Peoria would they build things to lose money.</p>
<p>A-Dumass &#8211; Where did I say to close it?  I&#8217;m not saying close it, I&#8217;m asking for fiscal responsibility to the community. My salary is bonus based on performance&#8230;maybe THAT pay structure should be initiated at some of Peoria&#8217;s money losing tax supported identities.  You can&#8217;t live off the base, but the closer you get the budget to black, the better your paycheck becomes.</p>
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		<title>By: Raoul Duke</title>
		<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/comment-page-1/#comment-92072</link>
		<dc:creator>Raoul Duke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2007 13:25:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/#comment-92072</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t expect to see a profit out of the Civi Center, just not a huge loss. I guess we need to look at what is a loss down there, how much additional money was made by local businesses downtown because of the civic center. There are plenty of food and drink establishments downtown that seem to do well because of the civic center. I would say that as long as the number gets smaller each year 300 grand aint too bad. I can tell you right now there is around 300k in new restaurant construction underway. (Firkin and Hound and the Eamon Patricks expansion into the old F. Scotts and a couple others being planned) Still on the fence on this one but it does not scream foul yet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t expect to see a profit out of the Civi Center, just not a huge loss. I guess we need to look at what is a loss down there, how much additional money was made by local businesses downtown because of the civic center. There are plenty of food and drink establishments downtown that seem to do well because of the civic center. I would say that as long as the number gets smaller each year 300 grand aint too bad. I can tell you right now there is around 300k in new restaurant construction underway. (Firkin and Hound and the Eamon Patricks expansion into the old F. Scotts and a couple others being planned) Still on the fence on this one but it does not scream foul yet.</p>
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		<title>By: Anti -Dumass</title>
		<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/comment-page-1/#comment-92070</link>
		<dc:creator>Anti -Dumass</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2007 13:03:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/#comment-92070</guid>
		<description>I know you are pissed about having to pay an extra cent or two when you buy your $1 menu double cheeseburgers, but I&#039;m pretty sure the shop owners and overall local economy appreciate the estimated $6 to $7million the IHSA finals bring in ever year.  And that&#039;s just one event.  

But your right . . .   let&#039;s just cut our losses, leave it empty, and sit back and wait for our city to be like East St. Louis or Detroit.  It really has helped their housing costs hasn&#039;t it.   

To quote Jason Bateman in Dodgeball after the main team forfeits . . .
&quot;It&#039;s a bold strategy Cotton, let&#039;s see how it pays off . . . &quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know you are pissed about having to pay an extra cent or two when you buy your $1 menu double cheeseburgers, but I&#8217;m pretty sure the shop owners and overall local economy appreciate the estimated $6 to $7million the IHSA finals bring in ever year.  And that&#8217;s just one event.  </p>
<p>But your right . . .   let&#8217;s just cut our losses, leave it empty, and sit back and wait for our city to be like East St. Louis or Detroit.  It really has helped their housing costs hasn&#8217;t it.   </p>
<p>To quote Jason Bateman in Dodgeball after the main team forfeits . . .<br />
&#8220;It&#8217;s a bold strategy Cotton, let&#8217;s see how it pays off . . . &#8220;</p>
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		<title>By: Anon E. Mouse</title>
		<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/comment-page-1/#comment-92000</link>
		<dc:creator>Anon E. Mouse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Aug 2007 14:47:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/#comment-92000</guid>
		<description>Chef Kevin - the onus is on you.  Find where it was ever promised or suggested that the PCC would turn a profit.

The Zoo, the Park District in general, and every other government run operation is run by the government because, if it were profitable, someone would have stepped up to do it already (or take it over).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chef Kevin &#8211; the onus is on you.  Find where it was ever promised or suggested that the PCC would turn a profit.</p>
<p>The Zoo, the Park District in general, and every other government run operation is run by the government because, if it were profitable, someone would have stepped up to do it already (or take it over).</p>
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		<title>By: chefkevin</title>
		<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/comment-page-1/#comment-91983</link>
		<dc:creator>chefkevin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Aug 2007 03:13:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/#comment-91983</guid>
		<description>Mouse says:  &quot;I sez: Since when was the PCC supposed to turn a profit?&quot;

So the powers who were 20+ years ago said this:  We promised to lose $300K a year for the next 30 years even though we are eventually going to collect HRA tax to help support it and it will STILL lose money.  I&#039;m sure that if you look back through old PJS articles you&#039;ll find someone, somewhere claimed the PCC would make money...like several other identities in Peoria were promised to make money.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mouse says:  &#8220;I sez: Since when was the PCC supposed to turn a profit?&#8221;</p>
<p>So the powers who were 20+ years ago said this:  We promised to lose $300K a year for the next 30 years even though we are eventually going to collect HRA tax to help support it and it will STILL lose money.  I&#8217;m sure that if you look back through old PJS articles you&#8217;ll find someone, somewhere claimed the PCC would make money&#8230;like several other identities in Peoria were promised to make money.</p>
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		<title>By: BJStone</title>
		<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/comment-page-1/#comment-91974</link>
		<dc:creator>BJStone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Aug 2007 23:06:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/#comment-91974</guid>
		<description>Apples and oranges, Super J. Compare the first two years of the US Cellular Coliseum to the first two years of the PCC&#039;s existence, and you&#039;ll see The Cell in Bloomington is doing MUCH better than the Civic Center in Peoria did when new. 

So it&#039;s an invalid comparison.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apples and oranges, Super J. Compare the first two years of the US Cellular Coliseum to the first two years of the PCC&#8217;s existence, and you&#8217;ll see The Cell in Bloomington is doing MUCH better than the Civic Center in Peoria did when new. </p>
<p>So it&#8217;s an invalid comparison.</p>
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		<title>By: Super J</title>
		<link>http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/comment-page-1/#comment-91968</link>
		<dc:creator>Super J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Aug 2007 21:05:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://peoriapundit.com/blogpeoria/2007/08/21/abandon-all-hope-for-a-profitable-civic-center/#comment-91968</guid>
		<description>You Peoria folks are such wusses. Over here in Bloomington, OUR Civic Center loses that much money in a MONTH, thank you very much.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You Peoria folks are such wusses. Over here in Bloomington, OUR Civic Center loses that much money in a MONTH, thank you very much.</p>
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